Mass Effect 2 - Why This Is the Future of the RPG
- Thread starter Dhruin
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Greymane
Watchdog
We all need to remember, these are all computer programs, not worlds of fantasy. Not every detail in a program will appeal to every 'user' of the program. Forcing every program into a classification that is not a universal truth will always get you into an argument. That being said, I understand some of what the article is on about. Endless inventory pickup because it's there is stupid. Who collects every plant, rock, tin can, squirrel tail on the way home? Who gets a numerical scale popup when they lift another heavy weight and feel a little stonger and it gives them a choice of raising strength or dexterity? Intelligent inventory gathering, stats that grow by usage, to me are great role play. Exploration is always a fun element, omitting it, reduces my enjoyment of a role playing game. And of course there needs to be elements of good and evil, it is what life is about, the struggle, isn't it?
Good friends, good enemies, good conversation, treachery, excellent tools of role play. The gun and the sword, are just tools, they should never be what the story is about.
My random thoughts...
Good friends, good enemies, good conversation, treachery, excellent tools of role play. The gun and the sword, are just tools, they should never be what the story is about.
My random thoughts...
I have mixed feelings about ME2. I just completed it - it was rather short: it took me 44 hours (according to my save games) to collect all companions, complete all their sub-missions, scan a bazillion planets, do a few planet quests, stare at the pretty scenery, play the annoyingly frequent mini-games etc. That is somewhat on the low side, given how much peripheral stuff I did, and the fact that I was not 'racing through' the game. If you ignore the companion stories, the central story - storytelling always been touted as Bioware's 'thing' - was very short, and drew heavily on themes, enemies etc from ME1. I thought Cerberus was quite interesting and the elusive (illusive?) man a compelling character. But everything else was kind of flat and only peripherally connected to the central story.
So, if the story was not central, what was? Well, from my perspective it all seemed to be about crouching behind boxes/walls and shooting stuff. The skill selection available was small, and to be honest, after you had unlocked all of the skills (early on), there was little to look forward too. The global cooldown meant you *had* to use weapons a lot (over powers/skills), even if that was not your play style. The enemies were repetitive - waves of the same, again and again. So, the game really played out as a shooter with lots of cut-scenes where small plot elements were introduced and you chatted to your colleagues about their feelings).
Anyway, the point is that while I enjoyed it - it was not really as an RPG (in the tradition of their former greats such as BG). I enjoyed it because it was a) pretty and b) it was somewhat more than a regular FPS (which usually bore me to tears) and c) it was sci-fi, a favourite genre of mine.
If any of those elements had been missing, I think I would have stopped playing.
Finally, while I have replayed most 'RPG's that I have, I do not see myself replaying this any time soon. I certainly hope this is *not* the future of RPG gaming, although I fear that once the big studios start doing this they will define what makes and RPG and we'll be stuck with it.
So, if the story was not central, what was? Well, from my perspective it all seemed to be about crouching behind boxes/walls and shooting stuff. The skill selection available was small, and to be honest, after you had unlocked all of the skills (early on), there was little to look forward too. The global cooldown meant you *had* to use weapons a lot (over powers/skills), even if that was not your play style. The enemies were repetitive - waves of the same, again and again. So, the game really played out as a shooter with lots of cut-scenes where small plot elements were introduced and you chatted to your colleagues about their feelings).
Anyway, the point is that while I enjoyed it - it was not really as an RPG (in the tradition of their former greats such as BG). I enjoyed it because it was a) pretty and b) it was somewhat more than a regular FPS (which usually bore me to tears) and c) it was sci-fi, a favourite genre of mine.
If any of those elements had been missing, I think I would have stopped playing.
Finally, while I have replayed most 'RPG's that I have, I do not see myself replaying this any time soon. I certainly hope this is *not* the future of RPG gaming, although I fear that once the big studios start doing this they will define what makes and RPG and we'll be stuck with it.
JemyM
Okay, now roll sanity.
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You are kidding right? 44 hours is over four times longer than your average game on the market.
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booboo,
I feel much the same about ME2. It was fun for the first playthrough as it was new, but after starting a second playthrough i immediatley got very bored and stopped playing.
Another thing i realised is that its actually broken game system because the PC doesnt actually have to do almost any fighting if he/she doesnt want. You can just take your 2 team-members into battle, hide behind a crate and let them do all the fighting and just revive them whenever they die. Try it, and i think you'll be surprised how easy it is to "game" the game - so to speak.
But i agree with you about spending so much time behind crates; it gets so predictable that one just knows by the level layout where the ambushes occur and allows plenty of time to storm to cover.
Another thing was how little there is to actually explore in ME2. Because the levels are so small and linear that one knows the game loike the back of one's hand after the first playthrough.
The cities like Omega, Citadel and Illium were really small and boring and also predictable in that the only people one can select to speak with have a quest attached, either immediately, or once their dialgue is unlocked by some other quest.
However what i really hated the most was how squad configuration has been removed almost completely. I dont see the point in playin g a squad based game unless one can develop in detail ones preferred squad and their configuration.
Personally i think these big games companies are spendingtoo much time and money on a huge cast of voice actors and have now substituted it in the place of good gameplay mechanics.
Yes i like good voice acting but not if its a chocie between that and good gameplay.
ME2 might get excellent sales but will it go down in most RPG players top 10 games of all time? I dont think so.
I feel much the same about ME2. It was fun for the first playthrough as it was new, but after starting a second playthrough i immediatley got very bored and stopped playing.
Another thing i realised is that its actually broken game system because the PC doesnt actually have to do almost any fighting if he/she doesnt want. You can just take your 2 team-members into battle, hide behind a crate and let them do all the fighting and just revive them whenever they die. Try it, and i think you'll be surprised how easy it is to "game" the game - so to speak.
But i agree with you about spending so much time behind crates; it gets so predictable that one just knows by the level layout where the ambushes occur and allows plenty of time to storm to cover.
Another thing was how little there is to actually explore in ME2. Because the levels are so small and linear that one knows the game loike the back of one's hand after the first playthrough.
The cities like Omega, Citadel and Illium were really small and boring and also predictable in that the only people one can select to speak with have a quest attached, either immediately, or once their dialgue is unlocked by some other quest.
However what i really hated the most was how squad configuration has been removed almost completely. I dont see the point in playin g a squad based game unless one can develop in detail ones preferred squad and their configuration.
Personally i think these big games companies are spendingtoo much time and money on a huge cast of voice actors and have now substituted it in the place of good gameplay mechanics.
Yes i like good voice acting but not if its a chocie between that and good gameplay.
ME2 might get excellent sales but will it go down in most RPG players top 10 games of all time? I dont think so.
- Joined
- Feb 9, 2010
- Messages
- 62
There are also some users who are willingly try to invent/imagine their own things when it is about to fill holes in what the game presents.
Others might not do this.
And probably even take things as they are, literally.
Really? For an RPG? I think not. I'm sorry, but a 10 hour game in the RPG genre would be a joke. 45 hours is short for an RPG, based on all the RPG titles I've played in the last 10-15 years. And "most games" do not interest me - RPG's do, which is why I'm on this site ;-)
@Coldcall: I agree with pretty much everything you said - I ejoyed it despite its shortcomings, but I think I now appreciate the 'interactive movie' comments others have made elsewhere. There were numerous faults that ticked me off, but not enough to stop playing.
I did enjoy some of the characters though: Mordin was hugely better than any of the rest! "I am the very model of a Scientist Sularian!" Along with all the strutting about. We wept, my precious, oh how we wept (well, almost).
I think I shall need to look elsewhere for my RPG fix - bring on AoD, Escahlon Bk 2, The Witcher 2 etc etc
Did you read his entire post?
Sadly, I've come to expect that from Bioware.
Greymane
Watchdog
Absolutely! This is one of the main reasons why I love games like Oblivion and Fallout 3, besides the great graphics, they give you more of a free form world, and an editor to allow those of us with a lot of imagination, the room to expand the game at least in our own gameplay. We can't suppose that everyone has that kind of imagination or the willingness and desire to use it in a digital medium.
Role playing means just being in a game becoming a player in it to some, and to others, it means becoming a part of a new and different digital world and somehow conforming it to our values.
What's the big deal? We all know ME2 is not "the future of the RPG", simply because noone ever tries to copy BioWare. It just doesn't happen. This is not like trying to copy Diablo, with a fairly simple formula. You need to pour far more money into a game than any other RPG developer can afford (other than Bethesda, I suppose) if you want to copy a formula that relies heavily on production values.
BG1-2, NWN, KotOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect, Dragon Age, Mass Effect 2.. every single one of those games got good reviews and sold a lot of copies. Not one of them were ever "copied" as far as I know, other than by Obsidian who worked together with BW on NWN2/KotOR2.
Certain elements, sure, but nothing else.
BG1-2, NWN, KotOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect, Dragon Age, Mass Effect 2.. every single one of those games got good reviews and sold a lot of copies. Not one of them were ever "copied" as far as I know, other than by Obsidian who worked together with BW on NWN2/KotOR2.
Certain elements, sure, but nothing else.