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SasqWatch
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- November 1, 2014
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Star Wars: The Last Jedi (2017)
I saw this for the first time over Christmas. I had seen all the positive and negative and general discussion reviews when it came out, but had forgotten most of them apart from the milking scene.
Overall, my only real issue was that I thought it lacked any stakes. At no point had the new series ever really laid the groundwork to tell the viewer what was at stake, what the new parameters of the conflict were, and, as such, I couldn't relate emotionally to anything that was happening, primarily with regards to characters.
We rewatched Force Awakens before this, so everything I say includes references to all the story from the beginning.
Firstly, the bad guys established their badness by rounding up a small village and butchering them. It's an inherently emotive scene, but other than generic emotiveness, it doesn't relate to any of the characters involved in the plot. AFAICT, none of our protagonists nor antagonists had any relation to anyone at the village beyond business.
Secondly, and similarly, when the new bad guys blew up the five planets with their new death star planet thing, we aren't made aware of any connection between any of our lead characters and those planets. Blowing up planets is generically emotive, but not specifically emotive. It's just business again.
Further to this second point, I don't understand why Coruscant was blown up. In the prequels it was established that Coruscant was the administrative centre of the known world, the place of bureaucratic governance. The old sith lords wanted control of Coruscant because this meant they ruled properly. The war was for control of government, not for the destruction of government.
So the new bad guys, at some point, must have decided that they could get power by blowing up Coruscant. But in a system-wide empire, you wouldn't win a war by just nuking New York City (the UN). Judging by the parliament scenes in the prequels, this UN structure houses thousands of faction's presidents. So is the new order, whatever they are, essentially decaling war on everyone?
And if they are declaring war on everyone, why are they so obsessed with chasing down just this one specific group of loyalist (?) dignitaries? Or is there tons more to the new order that we don't see, are we just watching one small unit of the new order chase down one small unit of loyalists? How big is the new order and how big is the restored republic at this point in time?
We last checked in on the timeline when the republic was restored and the Emperor and his empire fully defeated. We know approximately how much time as passed since then because returning characters have naturally aged a specific amount of time. So what's the republic been doing since then, and why are they still lagging behind the bad guys in planet-zapping technology & why is the new order able to thrive so close to Coruscant. Presumably with better funding than the republic too-boot.
The first film sets up some characters and a basic plot-line to justify the action. I was relatively content with how all that pans out, but, as I said at the time, the extent to which Force Awakens can be considered 'good' will depend entirely on how the following films tie into it. As an introduction it's an ok work.
But The Last Jedi didn't really go anywhere. The Last Jedi was just a continuation of the first film, but not a narrative continuation, just a continuation of the already established process of running away from the bad guys while trying to work out how to blow up their biggest zappy-weapon.
At the beginning of The Last Jedi, the good guys are running away and at the end they are running away, there is just fewer of them. Well, fewer extras, not really fewer protagonists, all of those have their expected plot-armour.
And I never really felt like anyone 'important' was going to die. We were just enjoying the spectacle of watching a gazillion extras get hosed down, which has entertainment value, just not emotional value. None of the good guys were even physically injured. Not even a new eyepatch or walking stick among them.
Obi-Wan died in ANH, Luke lost a hand in ESB, all the big bads die in RotJ, Qui-drunk-ill dies in tPM, and etc and etc, you get the idea, but no-one's dying at all in this new series, other than small bit-parters. Cameo heroes and villains of the week jobbies. For all the break-neck paced carnage and desperate subversions of expectations, there isn't any jeopardy at all.
And because there isn't any jeopardy, either from a world-setting perspective or a character-perspective, I simply couldn't get 'interested' in anyone's plight. I could sit there and eat popcorn and enjoy the ride for the ride's sake, but I honestly couldn't give too hoots about anyone on screen, let alone whatever struggles they were supposed to be having.
The original trilogy had awful settings jeopardy but excellent character jeopardy. The prequels had adequate settings jeopardy but awful character jeopardy. The Last Jedi (and now by default TFA) has neither settings nor character jeopardy.
After two very long films jam packed with content I am still pretty much clueless as to why I should care about any of them or their situation. What is the new order's objective beyond blowing up planets because that's the only thing that can get them hard any more, and what's the point of the republic if, after 50 years, it's still incapable of staying ahead in the big zappy-gun galactic arms race?
Will Fin ever run away? Will Poe ever get to deliver the winning pay load? Will Rey ever wear a robe with a hood? Will Kylo ever get something he wants for Christmas? Will Chewy be able to maintain ownership of the Millennium Falcon?
All this and more of the same level of mundanity hides behind the glorious visual orgasm.
Visually stimulating just as long as brain is in neutral 6/10.
I saw this for the first time over Christmas. I had seen all the positive and negative and general discussion reviews when it came out, but had forgotten most of them apart from the milking scene.
Overall, my only real issue was that I thought it lacked any stakes. At no point had the new series ever really laid the groundwork to tell the viewer what was at stake, what the new parameters of the conflict were, and, as such, I couldn't relate emotionally to anything that was happening, primarily with regards to characters.
We rewatched Force Awakens before this, so everything I say includes references to all the story from the beginning.
Firstly, the bad guys established their badness by rounding up a small village and butchering them. It's an inherently emotive scene, but other than generic emotiveness, it doesn't relate to any of the characters involved in the plot. AFAICT, none of our protagonists nor antagonists had any relation to anyone at the village beyond business.
Secondly, and similarly, when the new bad guys blew up the five planets with their new death star planet thing, we aren't made aware of any connection between any of our lead characters and those planets. Blowing up planets is generically emotive, but not specifically emotive. It's just business again.
Further to this second point, I don't understand why Coruscant was blown up. In the prequels it was established that Coruscant was the administrative centre of the known world, the place of bureaucratic governance. The old sith lords wanted control of Coruscant because this meant they ruled properly. The war was for control of government, not for the destruction of government.
So the new bad guys, at some point, must have decided that they could get power by blowing up Coruscant. But in a system-wide empire, you wouldn't win a war by just nuking New York City (the UN). Judging by the parliament scenes in the prequels, this UN structure houses thousands of faction's presidents. So is the new order, whatever they are, essentially decaling war on everyone?
And if they are declaring war on everyone, why are they so obsessed with chasing down just this one specific group of loyalist (?) dignitaries? Or is there tons more to the new order that we don't see, are we just watching one small unit of the new order chase down one small unit of loyalists? How big is the new order and how big is the restored republic at this point in time?
We last checked in on the timeline when the republic was restored and the Emperor and his empire fully defeated. We know approximately how much time as passed since then because returning characters have naturally aged a specific amount of time. So what's the republic been doing since then, and why are they still lagging behind the bad guys in planet-zapping technology & why is the new order able to thrive so close to Coruscant. Presumably with better funding than the republic too-boot.
The first film sets up some characters and a basic plot-line to justify the action. I was relatively content with how all that pans out, but, as I said at the time, the extent to which Force Awakens can be considered 'good' will depend entirely on how the following films tie into it. As an introduction it's an ok work.
But The Last Jedi didn't really go anywhere. The Last Jedi was just a continuation of the first film, but not a narrative continuation, just a continuation of the already established process of running away from the bad guys while trying to work out how to blow up their biggest zappy-weapon.
At the beginning of The Last Jedi, the good guys are running away and at the end they are running away, there is just fewer of them. Well, fewer extras, not really fewer protagonists, all of those have their expected plot-armour.
And I never really felt like anyone 'important' was going to die. We were just enjoying the spectacle of watching a gazillion extras get hosed down, which has entertainment value, just not emotional value. None of the good guys were even physically injured. Not even a new eyepatch or walking stick among them.
Obi-Wan died in ANH, Luke lost a hand in ESB, all the big bads die in RotJ, Qui-drunk-ill dies in tPM, and etc and etc, you get the idea, but no-one's dying at all in this new series, other than small bit-parters. Cameo heroes and villains of the week jobbies. For all the break-neck paced carnage and desperate subversions of expectations, there isn't any jeopardy at all.
And because there isn't any jeopardy, either from a world-setting perspective or a character-perspective, I simply couldn't get 'interested' in anyone's plight. I could sit there and eat popcorn and enjoy the ride for the ride's sake, but I honestly couldn't give too hoots about anyone on screen, let alone whatever struggles they were supposed to be having.
The original trilogy had awful settings jeopardy but excellent character jeopardy. The prequels had adequate settings jeopardy but awful character jeopardy. The Last Jedi (and now by default TFA) has neither settings nor character jeopardy.
After two very long films jam packed with content I am still pretty much clueless as to why I should care about any of them or their situation. What is the new order's objective beyond blowing up planets because that's the only thing that can get them hard any more, and what's the point of the republic if, after 50 years, it's still incapable of staying ahead in the big zappy-gun galactic arms race?
Will Fin ever run away? Will Poe ever get to deliver the winning pay load? Will Rey ever wear a robe with a hood? Will Kylo ever get something he wants for Christmas? Will Chewy be able to maintain ownership of the Millennium Falcon?
All this and more of the same level of mundanity hides behind the glorious visual orgasm.
Visually stimulating just as long as brain is in neutral 6/10.
- Joined
- Nov 1, 2014
- Messages
- 4,778
