KoA: Reckoning - Previews @ TenTonHammer

[Dhruin]

38 Studios recently held a big press event for Reckoning and the embargo for that ends today, so we'll see a mass of new previews soon. Here's an early one from TenTonHammer, who see "flaws" where others might see good news:

The narrative did have its flaws – if not necessarily in content, than in execution. The downside to having a game that would easily function as a series of novels is that you’ll have to read or listen to dialogue after dialogue to get the full effect, which really bogs down the otherwise intense nature of Reckoning’s gameplay. There’s ways around this – action RPGs have gotten very good at feeding players voiceover as they move and fight – but in Reckoning I fear too many players will miss out on some great storytelling in the rush to click past dialogue and get into the action.
Another disappointment with Reckoning’s storytelling, and something that simply won’t change before launch, is that the player character isn’t voiced. Studio Head Sean Dunn explained that with Reckoning’s 30,000+ lines of dialogue, it wasn’t possible to do several alternate voicings for both genders of the game’s 4 playable races and not add several Xbox discs to an already full cases. Other games have featured a mute protagonist to great effect, notably the Fallout series, but I personally prefer the more BioWare-ish, Ubisoft-ish tack of letting you experience your character’s choices from their own lips.

...and Blue's has some screens.
More information.

 

[blackcanopus]

Now this is what we get when an action game fan gets to write a very, very subjective article about an RPG.
I personally prefer when the main character has no voice, because I AM the main character. I am not Hawke, I am not Shepard, I am not Altair. I have my own voice and it totally ruins immersion when a jackass called Hawke or Shepard starts talking in my stead. But I also understand that's totally subjective and some people may prefer the other thing.
But dialog is something entirely different. It is one of the defining points of the RPG genre. This has nothing to do with being subjective. This guys likes action game, he go and play action games. But he must learn to keep his mouth shout when it comes to RPGs.

And for his information, UbiSoft is not known for making RPGs.

 

[DArtagnan]

Seems to me they'll have trouble marketing this game for the mainstream audience. They're doing a serious, deep and extremely meaty RPG with an "intense and awesome" action combat system.

Kinda hard to sell to the average joe looking for a way to spend a few hours on a sunday evening.

 

[Dhruin]

It's an interesting thought but with a February release it's too late to worry about that now. I'm feeling moderately optimistic about this…given the audience Bethsoft finds, maybe they can get some decent numbers.

 

[DArtagnan]

I'm certainly very excited for the game.

I love how the main writer had a "mantra" about every single location needing a history and a reason for being there.

It sounds like an explorer's dream.

 

[TomRon]

"Oblivion broke new ground in RPG immersiveness and open-endedness"

It did?

I don't think I like the guy that made this preview, but I'm starting to think I actually might like this game...

 

[Ball_Breaker]

I'm lookin' forward to this game, I like the atmosphere and even the Wow-ish graphics style a lot it reminds me a lot of a much more improved and polished version of Fable... Altough I prefered no quest markers at all, neither on characters' head nor on the minimap.

 

[SonOfCapiz]

"Oblivion broke new ground in RPG immersiveness and open-endedness"

It did?

I don't think I like the guy that made this preview, but I'm starting to think I actually might like this game…

That's where the reviewer lost me

 

[azarhal]

Kind of weird to read that preview, because TenTonHammer is a MMO website and most of the complains are about MMOish features (too many attacks, always spamming the same attack, mute protagonists, etc).

 

[Melvil]

complaining about narrative in an RPG...happy day for us I suppose

 

[Motoki]

complaining about narrative in an RPG…happy day for us I suppose

You mean we have to listen to people talk, or, even worse, READ? *gasp* The horror!

Also, I'm not sure what the hell he is talking about with other action RPGs feeding you the story while the action is going on but I am getting a rather amusing image along the lines of:

Elf: So there was this evil wizard…

*SLASH*

Elf: But he didn't start out that way…

*cuts an orcs throat*

Elf: He was in magic school…

*drop kicks a Kobold*

Elf: And his teacher said…BEHIND YOU

Player: His teach said behind you?

Elf: No there's a troll…

*Player dies*

Elf:…*sighs* behind you.

 

[Saxon1974]

Lot's of dialog to read? Awesome, I love deep RPG worlds.

Not loving the huge weapons nor the WOW look although some of the environments looks pretty nice. Also dont like the look of the combat...

But other than that I am a little optimistic about this title.

It's funny pretty much every complaint action gamers have is exactly what I want.

 

[Capt. Huggy Face]

Pretty much my thoughts exactly with everything you said, Saxon, except being optimistic about this game. It's stuff like this that just turn me off right away:

"When you have all enemies in the encounter in this state (or before, if you’re unwise), you can end their fates with a flurry of dazzling and deadly animations, chalking up an experience bonus by mashing the button displayed on the screen in the process."

Didn't much like what I saw of the art style, but my biggest problem was with the feel of the combat. It just looks too arcadey for me. Although, Divinity II's combat was a bit arcadey for me, too, but I liked that game overall. They got pretty much everything else right, as far as I was concerned. If folks here start hollering about how great Reckoning is, maybe I'll check it out.

 

[Motoki]

It's funny pretty much every complaint action gamers have is exactly what I want.

Honestly, action and RPG gamers are so diametrically opposed that I really don't think combining the two and making a game that will try to appeal to both is such a great idea. Of course, game companies are looking for as much money as possible these days, niche is not enough, so they don't care what I think.

Didn't much like what I saw of the art style, but my biggest problem was with the feel of the combat. It just looks too arcadey for me.

That's kind of how I feel too. While I, like others, actually find the action gamer's laments encouring, I still have reservations.

It's quite possible this game could end up turning off both action and RPG gamers with enough elements in it to annoy both. We'll see.

 

[Deleted User]

Honestly, action and RPG gamers are so diametrically opposed that I really don't think combining the two and making a game that will try to appeal to both is such a great idea. Of course, game companies are looking for as much money as possible these days, niche is not enough, so they don't care what I think.



That's kind of how I feel too. While I, like others, actually find the action gamer's laments encouring, I still have reservations.

It's quite possible this game could end up turning off both action and RPG gamers with enough elements in it to annoy both. We'll see.

I don't think it's so much about combining action and RPGs together, it's simply taking an element from action games (the combat) and adding it to your hardcore RPG. I do think action gamers will fall in love with the combat and end up "putting up with" the RPG elements just because they love the combat so much. And I think that was the idea they had when they came up with this system. They want to entice action gamers over to the RPG world, and get some cross pollination going on.

As a hardcore RPG fan, that thought is scary, because we don't want an action game, we want a hardcore RPG. But I think based on what has been shown so far, we'll be getting a hardcore RPG, that simply happens to have action combat sewn on top of it. The sales pitch so far has been, "all your RPG actions are what wins you the battles, not the action combat skills, although, if you are really good at the combat, you can also defeat enemies a few levels higher than yourself at any given time." So they are trying to appeal to both crowds. Ultimately, they are walking a tight rope, but I have faith in the developers to pull it off. It could result in combat that becomes too easy as you get good at the game, but there's always difficulty settings you can change.

I don't think there is a chance the game will annoy RPGamers. There's enough elements of a hardcore RPG there to keep RPG fans happy. The only quirk is getting used to the action combat. It's going to take some playing of the game to get people to buy into it, but I think once we have the game in our hands we will be sold on it. We'll see I guess. It's a waiting game. I do have faith in the team at 38 since so much is riding on this title. The future of their company really is being determined by how well this game sells. If it doesn't drum up enough interest for their MMO, then the whole thing will be a complete failure. People work best under that type of pressure, so we'll see what happens.

 

[Motoki]

If this looks like a hardcore RPG to you than I think your definition of that is very different from mine.

Honestly, I have given up on getting what I consider a hardcore RPG from anywhere but possibly indies and even those are getting more and more streamlined and diluted.

 

[Deleted User]

I consider Morrowind a hardcore RPG, for what it's worth. I haven't played any game lately that came close to that experience. Maybe Divinity 2 could be considered hardcore in some aspects. So while I wouldn't say KoA is going to be as hardcore as Morrowind, it's probably the best we're going to get at this point. Hardcore RPGs don't come along much anymore. I realize no one wants to take a chance and isolate "casual" gamers anymore, so they just don't get made. But if you look at what this game has got, it's definitely got some hardcore RPG elements.

Over 60 combat abilities spread throughout 3 skill trees
10 non-combat skills such as lockpicking, dispelling, etc
3 deep crafting systems (alchemy, blacksmithing, sagecraft)
Hundreds of side quests
6 separate factions each with their own unique story line (and rumored 20-30 hours of content for each faction)
etc

Those are some tasty RPG elements right there. To me, those things make this game a day one purchase. I guess some people aren't as easily impressed though. Maybe with more videos coming out and gameplay footage people will change their minds.

 

[Motoki]

Those are some tasty RPG elements right there. To me, those things make this game a day one purchase. I guess some people aren't as easily impressed though. Maybe with more videos coming out and gameplay footage people will change their minds.

That's hype from the developer and so are the videos, which are hardly objective and sometimes can be downright deceptive (Radiant AI anyone?).

I will probably get this game at some point, but I am waiting for a fair amount of user reviews to come in and maybe a demo if there is one before deciding. Unless a majority of people whose opinions I consider reputable absolutely rave about it, then I'll probably just get it on sale and/or wait for a GOTY edition.

There is no way I am making a pre-order or day one purchase, especially for something under the EA umbrella.

 

[wolfgrimdark]

So far this is on the top of my must buy list, Course Skyrim is also on my list. Knowing there is a lot to explore, plenty of dialogue and NO voiced protagonist are all very high pluses in my book for a good game.

I don't mind the graphics or combat as long as it also has other things I like. But then I happen to like the graphics and can be flexible to some degree on combat (as long as it isn't as bad as DA2 was).

I have watched a bunch of clips, been following the Q&A and the reviews and overall pretty happy all things considered with todays market.

 

[kuki]

I consider Morrowind a hardcore RPG, for what it's worth. I haven't played any game lately that came close to that experience. Maybe Divinity 2 could be considered hardcore in some aspects. So while I wouldn't say KoA is going to be as hardcore as Morrowind, it's probably the best we're going to get at this point. Hardcore RPGs don't come along much anymore. I realize no one wants to take a chance and isolate "casual" gamers anymore, so they just don't get made. But if you look at what this game has got, it's definitely got some hardcore RPG elements.

Over 60 combat abilities spread throughout 3 skill trees
10 non-combat skills such as lockpicking, dispelling, etc
3 deep crafting systems (alchemy, blacksmithing, sagecraft)
Hundreds of side quests
6 separate factions each with their own unique story line (and rumored 20-30 hours of content for each faction)
etc

Those are some tasty RPG elements right there. To me, those things make this game a day one purchase. I guess some people aren't as easily impressed though. Maybe with more videos coming out and gameplay footage people will change their minds.

I am here on the same page as Fluent.

Game really looks promising and could be the perfect synergy of RPG and combat.

I think they are emphasizing combat right now so they could get action oriented players who are afraid of the text dialogs to buy the game

I found this interview with R.A. Salvatore which gives me high hope for a good story.

http://diehardgamefan.com/2011/10/05/interview-with-r-a-salvatore-author-and-creator-of-worlds/
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DHGF: I’d actually like to start a bit with Kingdoms of Amalur: Reckoning. How involved were you or are you still with the development of Kingdoms of Amalur: Reckoning?

R.A. SALVATORE: Quite a bit. My official title at 38 Studios is Creator Of Worlds. So, basically what I did was I created this ten thousand year history for the World of Amalur, and really where the races are, why they’re there, what the economies are, how everything ties together. The consistency of the world if you will. So for several years I was in there working on this with the teams, the art teams and the design team. Then when we acquired Big Huge Games, and decided to do an open world RPG as our first product while we continue to work on the MMO, they had to look at that history and pull out a time in that history that would be a good time to set their game and then come up with a storyline.

I had to go down there and approve it and work on it with them and, you know, help them edit it and get it to where they wanted it to be. So I’ve been very involved. This has been a five year project and counting for me.

DHGF: I’ll be honest, our interest piqued a bit when I saw the first ad for the game and saw you and Todd McFarlane were attached.

SALVATORE: I’ve been dying for it to come out, since for five years I haven’t been able to talk about the world. And now it’s coming out, finally. Cause we want the products to speak for themselves and I think it’s going to be amazing and I can’t wait for it to come out.
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