If the cpu is not starting then it is most likely a power issue either with the psu or the cabling.
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Oh yea it might also be the power button.
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But if the fans come on when he pushes the power button then i guess it is not likely that.
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He does have a power button directly on the motherboard if he needs to try that.
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Oh yea it might also be the power button.
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But if the fans come on when he pushes the power button then i guess it is not likely that.
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He does have a power button directly on the motherboard if he needs to try that.
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pibbur who
Guest
I say thank you to all of you for all your help so far. Much appreciated.
pibbur who is happy to be a watcher (although not a happy watcher atm). And who will inform the watch about how things work out, if they work out.
PS. Now I'm going to work out. DS.
pibbur who is happy to be a watcher (although not a happy watcher atm). And who will inform the watch about how things work out, if they work out.
PS. Now I'm going to work out. DS.
P
pibbur who
Guest
About a new PSU. If I'm going to get a new PSU for the old PC now, I will eventually use it in a new PC, which I will get this year or early next year.
This is what the new PC will look like. My selection of parts is based on what's in my current gaming PC, which I'm very happy with. It is however mostly a basis for estimating PSU requirements, details may change when time for shopping arrives. I will for now reuse as much as I can.
Recommendations (for the PSU, only, too early for the other things)?
One final question. What about M.2 Internal SSDs in stead of "normal" SSDs? A couple of those are on sale as well, and the MB supports 2 of them.
pibbur whose body needs a 150 W PSU.
This is what the new PC will look like. My selection of parts is based on what's in my current gaming PC, which I'm very happy with. It is however mostly a basis for estimating PSU requirements, details may change when time for shopping arrives. I will for now reuse as much as I can.
- Asus ROG Maxium X Code MB (have the Maximum VII Formula now, happy with that)
- I7 8700K CPU (the joxer will disagree, but I'm going to use the machine for more than gaming, some of those things will benefit from this kind of CPU).
- 1 GTX 980, Already have that. Within a year or two to be replaced later by 1 1080 Ti or something similar.
- 16 GB RAM, possibly 32 GB later
- 2-3 256 GB SSDs, already have those
- 2 HDs (2TB, 7200 RPM), already have those
- CPU water cooling, already have that
- The cabinet, a Cooler Master HAF X Big Tower (which I already have) comes with 3 200 mm fans, and a 230 mm one.
Recommendations (for the PSU, only, too early for the other things)?
One final question. What about M.2 Internal SSDs in stead of "normal" SSDs? A couple of those are on sale as well, and the MB supports 2 of them.
pibbur whose body needs a 150 W PSU.
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Ripper
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That PSU sounds fine to me. There's a similar Corsair powering my desktop. Shouldn't be any complications with a single graphics card.
I don't have experience with M2. I know it connects to the PCIE bus bypassing the controller, allowing for theoretically higher speeds. There's various complications around different types, different configurations of PCIE lanes, etc. Probably need a bit of research on what would be a good option for your motherboard.
I don't have experience with M2. I know it connects to the PCIE bus bypassing the controller, allowing for theoretically higher speeds. There's various complications around different types, different configurations of PCIE lanes, etc. Probably need a bit of research on what would be a good option for your motherboard.
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I prefer platinum psu made by seasonic, delta or superflower. Corsair doesn't make psu they just rebrand em. There are several good psu review sites including johnnyguru; this site will provide a list of all reviews (well probably not all) for each psu:
http://www.realhardtechx.com/index_archivos/Page447.htm (i happen to point it at corsair but they have the same list for most major brands). 650 watt should be fine if the psu is good quality; the gtx 980 is a power pig but anything newer will use significantly less power.
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Make sure the cpu you buy has the meltdown fix (intel has promised new cpu by the end of the summer with a hardware fix).
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There are several different types of m.2 include both interface (such as b key and m key) and length 42mm and 80mm are common. There are also 'sata' m.2 cards. The 'key' are the number of pcie lane (2 and 4) and determines transfer rate. The sata m.2 cards basically use sata transfer protocol are are slower than the b key. This sounds overly complicated but if you buy a new board and a new m.2 card they should be compatible (though it wouldn't hurt if you check at purchase time).
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for the ssd i prefer samsung though will consider crucial (mx500 is pretty good bargin); sand-disk (now wd) and intel (usually way over priced for the good stuff).
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My reluctance with m.2 is that access after build is a pain and if you want to move it or tweak it later sata drives tend to be easier to deal with - esp the move part. While something like the nvme m.2 samsung 960 pro is insanely fast usually sata is fast enough. Also m.2 standard is new and rapidly evolving so the future compatibility is uncertain (look waht happened with msata).
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You can save a lot of money and do better than that motherboard but it is your choice - i've been very happy with the asrock extreme series. Asus isn't bad but their support isn't great and asrock bios has been more convenient to myself (I currently have 6 active systems - 2 are family members that i maintain) and mb brands i'm currently using include msi (well until last summer it was retired); asrock, asus, and ecs (hey they were selling a z97 itx board for $100 and no one else even had one available a year ago). I use the ecs in my windows gaming box - and only reason for purchase was only z97 itx board and i wanted to re-use ddr3 ram - but it has been a fine mb - cept bios is a bit limited for a z97.
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Btw if you go with m.2 make sure the board has enough sata ports - as most m.2 implementations will share pci lanes with sata ports (you use one or the other).
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I wanted to clarify when i talk about bios - i'm not big on overclocking - though done it a bit in the past - when concerns me these days are easy access to boot device; bios upgrade if needed; major settings (turning stuff on/off boot order/system status and similar). Something like gigabyte might have every setting in the world with regards to overclocking but if it is a pain to find things in the setting or i can't easily tell the system to ignore the system disk and boot from a usb - i don't want to mess with it. For the msi board i had to build a dos boot image to flash the bios - the bios had to be updated to support a new graphic card so it wasn't optional - i don't want to do that crap these days - i want to point at the bios and flash it. Having a backup bios is a plus in case the flash goes bad. Also for my next build asrock as some interesting oddity boards - like one with 10 sata ports (lsi controller) which I need for my server.
http://www.realhardtechx.com/index_archivos/Page447.htm (i happen to point it at corsair but they have the same list for most major brands). 650 watt should be fine if the psu is good quality; the gtx 980 is a power pig but anything newer will use significantly less power.
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Make sure the cpu you buy has the meltdown fix (intel has promised new cpu by the end of the summer with a hardware fix).
-
There are several different types of m.2 include both interface (such as b key and m key) and length 42mm and 80mm are common. There are also 'sata' m.2 cards. The 'key' are the number of pcie lane (2 and 4) and determines transfer rate. The sata m.2 cards basically use sata transfer protocol are are slower than the b key. This sounds overly complicated but if you buy a new board and a new m.2 card they should be compatible (though it wouldn't hurt if you check at purchase time).
-
for the ssd i prefer samsung though will consider crucial (mx500 is pretty good bargin); sand-disk (now wd) and intel (usually way over priced for the good stuff).
-
My reluctance with m.2 is that access after build is a pain and if you want to move it or tweak it later sata drives tend to be easier to deal with - esp the move part. While something like the nvme m.2 samsung 960 pro is insanely fast usually sata is fast enough. Also m.2 standard is new and rapidly evolving so the future compatibility is uncertain (look waht happened with msata).
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You can save a lot of money and do better than that motherboard but it is your choice - i've been very happy with the asrock extreme series. Asus isn't bad but their support isn't great and asrock bios has been more convenient to myself (I currently have 6 active systems - 2 are family members that i maintain) and mb brands i'm currently using include msi (well until last summer it was retired); asrock, asus, and ecs (hey they were selling a z97 itx board for $100 and no one else even had one available a year ago). I use the ecs in my windows gaming box - and only reason for purchase was only z97 itx board and i wanted to re-use ddr3 ram - but it has been a fine mb - cept bios is a bit limited for a z97.
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Btw if you go with m.2 make sure the board has enough sata ports - as most m.2 implementations will share pci lanes with sata ports (you use one or the other).
-
I wanted to clarify when i talk about bios - i'm not big on overclocking - though done it a bit in the past - when concerns me these days are easy access to boot device; bios upgrade if needed; major settings (turning stuff on/off boot order/system status and similar). Something like gigabyte might have every setting in the world with regards to overclocking but if it is a pain to find things in the setting or i can't easily tell the system to ignore the system disk and boot from a usb - i don't want to mess with it. For the msi board i had to build a dos boot image to flash the bios - the bios had to be updated to support a new graphic card so it wasn't optional - i don't want to do that crap these days - i want to point at the bios and flash it. Having a backup bios is a plus in case the flash goes bad. Also for my next build asrock as some interesting oddity boards - like one with 10 sata ports (lsi controller) which I need for my server.
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Keep in mind that the issue might even just be a bad motherboard. A shock or a blown cap when it was last powered on or moved.
P
pibbur who
Guest
Battery won't help with the boot issue; the primary issue with a bad battery is the bios will forget the settings on each time you turn off the computer for a while - and hte clock will reset....
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pibbur who
Guest
- My vendor has Seasonic PSUs, but not the platinum series.
- I have already a Maximum VII Formula MB, and have been very happy with that. Hence the Core MB which equals Formula, but without water cooling. My vendor doesn't have Asrock MB's.
- I think I'll avoid the m.2, a bit too cumbersome.
But while we're at it, perhaps I should consider a Ryzen? Until now I've stuck to Intel, mainly because way back in the eighties it was claimed that AMD wasn't entirely compatible. It may not have been true then, most likely it's not true now. OTOH, I've never built an AMD PC before, so I don't know if there are particular things to consider when doing that, like the type of PSU required, cooling thingies and so on. Are there?
pibbur
PS. I could of course check what components other vendors have on offer. But I'm very happy with the service of the vendor I've been using for years, so I'd like to stay with them. DS.
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pibbur who
Guest
I got a new battery today, so I will try that of course. Haven't wasted much money if that doesn't work.
pibbur
Kordanor
Wastelander
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- June 2, 2012
- Messages
- 4,703
Ryzen and Intel shouldn't be that different to handle. Pretty much the same as having a different intel socket. You just have to have a matching board (and check cpu cooler compatibility)
Furthermore Ryzen seems to scale better with fast ram. So you might not want to go for the cheapest option there.
Furthermore Ryzen seems to scale better with fast ram. So you might not want to go for the cheapest option there.
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Replacing the battery probably won't help you, however the act of removing the battery and booting without it could. On some boards it's similar to activating the motherboard reset jumper.
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pibbur who
Guest
My pusher has PC upgrade packages, which is a bit cheaper than buying the parts separately. The following are about the same price:
Intel processor:
I can't change the components if I'm buying one of the packages, but I can alsways add components, like more RAM.
Comments?
pibbur
Intel processor:
- Intel LGA1151 Core i7-8700K
- MSI LGA1151 Z370-A PRO
- Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 2666MHz 16GB
- AMD AM4 Ryzen 7 2700X
- ASUS AM4 ROG STRIX X470-F GAMING
- HyperX Predator DDR4 3000MHz 16GB
I can't change the components if I'm buying one of the packages, but I can alsways add components, like more RAM.
Comments?
pibbur
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I was really unhappy with MSI bios upgrade but my motherboard was a sandbridge mb and things might have improved; not sure. As I remember there are two major bios used by all manufacturer with individual vendor tweaks. The board itself had a few design flaws and 2 months after I purchased it they fixed those flaws so I give them credit for quick fixes and I've always been happy with msi support (something I won't say about asus). the MSI board you picked has bottom end audio chip but unless you are super sensitive you won't notice (that's common with all bottom tier boards) it also uses a bottom end ethernet chip but again this will be a non issue.
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Avoid boards with killer ethernet - intel is top tier realtek is bottom but the difference doesn't matter in practice.
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realtek 892 is bottom
realtek 1220 is better - but to be honest most people can't hear the difference
some have creative chips - avoid (creative driver support sucks but others swear by them)
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some boards have special isolation circurity to prevent audio crosstalk
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The msi z370-a pro is your basic bottom tier board; it should have a bottom tier price.
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in the us i would buy a i7-8700k because mircrocenter sells it cheaper than a non K and anyone else in usa when purchased with a mb which is also cheaper than anyone else in usa - but if I had to pay a premium I would buy a non-k processor because I don't bother to overclock. If this fits you then consider. Generally the K processor (non overclocked) does run faster than the non-k version if that matters (higher normal clock rate) - i haven't looked into at the 8700k specifically because I'm waiting for the next generation icy something or other to upgrade my system and my last upgrade was haswell refresh - i'm skipping skylake and coffelake - besides i never liked coffe.
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Avoid boards with killer ethernet - intel is top tier realtek is bottom but the difference doesn't matter in practice.
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realtek 892 is bottom
realtek 1220 is better - but to be honest most people can't hear the difference
some have creative chips - avoid (creative driver support sucks but others swear by them)
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some boards have special isolation circurity to prevent audio crosstalk
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The msi z370-a pro is your basic bottom tier board; it should have a bottom tier price.
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in the us i would buy a i7-8700k because mircrocenter sells it cheaper than a non K and anyone else in usa when purchased with a mb which is also cheaper than anyone else in usa - but if I had to pay a premium I would buy a non-k processor because I don't bother to overclock. If this fits you then consider. Generally the K processor (non overclocked) does run faster than the non-k version if that matters (higher normal clock rate) - i haven't looked into at the 8700k specifically because I'm waiting for the next generation icy something or other to upgrade my system and my last upgrade was haswell refresh - i'm skipping skylake and coffelake - besides i never liked coffe.
P
pibbur who
Guest
Looked a bit at reviews.
Seems to me that the better package in this case is the AMD, at least the MB seems to be the better choice, so more bang for the NOK, since both packages cost nearly the same. I will want to overclock, which suggest water-cooling, but I only do that after a couple of years, and I can always buy water-cooling then.
But of course, there is the dilemma: I7 or Ryzen?
Hmmm.
pibbur who has yet to make up his mind about whether to build a new system now or not. And if he decides to do that whether to go for the Ryzen or the i7. And if he manages to choose something, whether to go for a package or individually selected components. And who really likes coffee (but despises Java).
Seems to me that the better package in this case is the AMD, at least the MB seems to be the better choice, so more bang for the NOK, since both packages cost nearly the same. I will want to overclock, which suggest water-cooling, but I only do that after a couple of years, and I can always buy water-cooling then.
But of course, there is the dilemma: I7 or Ryzen?
Hmmm.
pibbur who has yet to make up his mind about whether to build a new system now or not. And if he decides to do that whether to go for the Ryzen or the i7. And if he manages to choose something, whether to go for a package or individually selected components. And who really likes coffee (but despises Java).
Ripper
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Personally, I won't buy a CPU until the speculative execution flaw is fixed in their design. It's important to note that Meltdown and Spectre are just the specific vulnerabilities that have been found so far as a result of this fundamental flaw. Many more could remain. A fix in the hardware is required.
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Well AMD did not really have a serious meltdown security issue - one of the support chips did have a minor issue and I believe it has been fixed. The ryzen is a seriously good chip on paper and people feedback and it has some real benefits over intel esp if you use the gpu (which you don't). My only issue with the amd solution is finding a good mb. Historically in operand and thunderbird days the mb chipsets were always suspect and third party - in the end nforce4 was pretty decent. If the mb is good then I would go with the amd solution in this case esp since it has fewer security issues.
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For me personally in a gaming system I would have no issue with an amd solution but I would need to put effort into picking the right mb. For a server I would be a little bit more concern since I do some things that are not main-stream and therefore are more likely to tickle issues.
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Unfortunately this is a bit nebulous and I can't give you first hand feedback on your specific choices. I could read reviews and user feedback et all on the mb but you can do that just as easily.
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For me personally in a gaming system I would have no issue with an amd solution but I would need to put effort into picking the right mb. For a server I would be a little bit more concern since I do some things that are not main-stream and therefore are more likely to tickle issues.
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Unfortunately this is a bit nebulous and I can't give you first hand feedback on your specific choices. I could read reviews and user feedback et all on the mb but you can do that just as easily.
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