Obsidian Entertainment - Josh Sawyer Interview

[ChienAboyeur]

I guess the great thing about RPGs is there is so much variety out there of games which are capable of disproving everything you have just said. But even if you take away actual examples (something practically every one of your posts on this site lacks in favour of grandiose generalisations) and communicate on a purely generalised level… well obviously.

The depiction fits too many RPGs to enumerate. That is the issue.
This site has a data base: taking a product at random, big chances it fits the bill.

Now apply the same over-thinking, over-philosophical mindset to Mario, what does Mario do that doesn't apply to what you've just said about RPGs?

There is no over philosophical mindset. There is no philosophy in basic observations.
Same basic observations that tell SMB does not fit the bill: avoidance is a big factor, bosses do not die, use of power ups etc
In RPGs, the tendency is to destroy as much as possible, the reward being power. Clearing a level is a common thing.
In SMB, the progression is made by destroying the least possible.


Apparently, a post went missing.

A few fallacies were mentioned in it.

People killed by lions. Tanzania was given as an example. Tanzania is home to the Masai. This explains things.

Supposedly, up to recent times, tribal people in jungle used to fight each other in massive battles to eat the flesh off the losers.

Tribes are small units accounting 200 people for example. The massive battles pitted as a high 30 people vs people. The saxons when they took GB from from the Celts already pitted 500 vs 500.

As to eating people, since SA is home to people who lived in the jungles, there were people eating other people and people who did not.
When invaders from Europe landed, it turned obvious very fast they would prefer to hit people who did not eat their captives rather those who did.
It had two consequences: people who ate people were selected by Europeans and people who did not eat captives kept used to spread the tale they were eating people. As a tale to protect themselves.

 

[lackblogger]

The depiction fits too many RPGs to enumerate. That is the issue.
This site has a data base: taking a product at random, big chances it fits the bill.

What a cop-out.

There is no over philosophical mindset. There is no philosophy in basic observations.

Of course its over-philosophy, you're playing a computer fantasy game in an alternative universe and applying 21st century western real world philosophy.

Same basic observations that tell SMB does not fit the bill: avoidance is a big factor

You can run through levels with zero combat even in Diablo if you choose to, but, like in Mario, jumping on a mushroom to boost your jumping distance will be required at some point, as will running through mushrooms while in invincible mode.

bosses do not die

As I've already stated, killing demons banishes them to another plane for a time but doesn't actually kill them, but you ignored that point to make this point, I guess.

use of power ups etc

You mean… like potions and spells and stuffies?

In RPGs, the tendency is to destroy as much as possible

You destroy more in Mario than you do in any RPG, block after block after block.

the reward being power.

Power? Are you on meds? Aren't all games some form of power fantasy regardless of combat? Compared to a strategy game an RPG is like playing 'some guy', lol (bioware excluded ofc). What about Tycoon games?

Clearing a level is a common thing.

Yes, in computer games clearing a level is pretty much a normal activity, you really added a salient point with lots of detailed elaboration there…

In SMB, the progression is made by destroying the least possible.

You mean by smashing blocks, killing mushrooms and beating up the bad guy at the end, yeah, ok buddy, you really sound like you know the games your even talking about.

A few fallacies were mentioned in it.

People killed by lions. Tanzania was given as an example. Tanzania is home to the Masai. This explains things.

Supposedly, up to recent times, tribal people in jungle used to fight each other in massive battles to eat the flesh off the losers.

Tribes are small units accounting 200 people for example. The massive battles pitted as a high 30 people vs people. The saxons when they took GB from from the Celts already pitted 500 vs 500.

As to eating people, since SA is home to people who lived in the jungles, there were people eating other people and people who did not.
When invaders from Europe landed, it turned obvious very fast they would prefer to hit people who did not eat their captives rather those who did.
It had two consequences: people who ate people were selected by Europeans and people who did not eat captives kept used to spread the tale they were eating people. As a tale to protect themselves.

How wonderful of you to add additional unnecessary details about real world specifics that have nothing to do with any of the points made other than in your own mind. Until you explain how a fantasy giant ant is comparable to a real world ant in approach and resolution, it's pretty meaningless to spend so much time on this aspect without ABSTRACTING.

And well done, now I'm having to reply to every sentence the rest of the site will rush in and say how awful this thread has become, so, thanks for that, you're a real star.

 

[ChienAboyeur]

There is no over philosophy. There is no application of 21st century real world philosophy.
That was a mere depiction of a core drive in RPGs.

Diablo is a poor example: if walking past the necessary mechanics of destruction was that accessible, it would be shown in glitchless speedruns. It is not, they show an optimization of the rate of destruction: destroying faster, bigger and larger.

SMB is not about destroying every block.
In a RPG, finishing a level means clearing it of destructible entities.
In SMB, finishing a level means leaving a number of destructible entities behind.

RPG is certainly not about playing some guy. It is about playing one of those guys.

A tyccoon game is obviously about power as it must be by design. The same cant be said about RPGs.

The bit on the RPG cliché about the entity that can not be destroyed, only banished is excellent as it also is part of playing as one of those guys.
In SMB, the difference is that bosses could be destroyed. They are not.

 

[Ripper]

Needs more gifs.

 

[JDR13]

 

[Archangel]

I gave up. I figured out he is either trolling or to dense to ever understand so why bother.

 

[bjon045]

I hope he keeps going. PoE was one of my favourite games I played last year and I loved everything about it including the ruleset.